reef/roller furler line suggestions

[asdf777]

About 150' is needed for reef outhaul (3 reefs to the cockpit), and 45' for the roller furler. Preferably something light and easy on the hands when it's both wet and dry. I'm thinking of Samson ultra-lite, 3/8" for the reefs and Samson warpspeed II 5/16" for the roller furler, but I haven't used either of these lines...

There are probably better and cheaper options.

Many thanks!
Gleb

[Brion Toss]

Hi,
What size boat? Unless it's under 25ft, you might need a longer furler line.
Fair leads,
Brion Toss

[asdf777]

It's a 30' sloop. There is a 90% jib on the roller furler, so it should be 11' foot length + 30' boat length + some extra. You're probably right. 50 or 55'.

What kind of rope would you recommend?

Many thanks!
Gleb

[Stumble]

Asdf,

How much splicing are you willing to do? My favorite furling line comes in two parts. The first runs from the drum to the last turning block and is 3/16 amsteel blue. It is way to small to be used by hand, but the small size means it rolls very well on the drum. To this I splice a much larger Tenex single braid as long as needed reach the back of the boat with the sail fully rolled.

It takes some time to make, but it reduces drum problems, and leaves a nice size line to work with.

You could do the same thing easier, but with a lot more expense by tapering something like endurabraid, but you really don't need the extra strength.

[asdf777]

Hi, Stumble,

Splicing dyneema into something else sounds like a great idea! I should probably do the same with the reefs to keep the weight to a minimum. The only question is how do I do it? I've never spliced dyneema into another rope.

Tried googling, but couldn't find any instructions - just to make an eye, but I don't think it's the same technique, is it?

Thanks,
Gleb

[Stumble]

There are different ways to do it depending on what line you use.

http://l-36.com/halyard_splice.php
http://l-36.com/halyard.php

[asdf777]

Hmm. Thank you. This doesn't look easy... Wondering if I should start splicing something less critical than a roller furling line and reefs. There can be a big trouble if either of these lines break.

It's a great idea, though!

Thanks,
Gleb

[Terrier]

Stumble,
Very nice instructions! How do you secure the Amstel to the drum? Thank you,

Tom

[Brion Toss]

Hello,
The tail splice variations are particularly attractive if you have a crowded drum. A similar effect can be achieved by stripping the core out of the first few feet of a double-braid furling line. Both techniques give you the option of using a fatter line than 3/8", which is a good thing for handling. The double-braid method is usually much cheaper. In either case, if you have a crowded drum, it is fairly likely that you have an undersized furler...
With reefs the stripped-out-core method isn't an option, as the loads are constant throughout the length of the line (on the jib furler, the loads have gone away by the time the coreless section is exposed). The tapered method works, but is less compelling, because given the length of the boom relative to the height of the reef clew, you can only taper a bit more than that height and still not have skinny rope in your hands when the clew is to the boom. Basically you end up with skinny rope on one side of the sail and fat rope on the other, at full hoist. It can still be worth doing, just not as much as with the furling line.
With reefs, however, the problem is often that they are oversized for the loads. When properly vectored, you have a nearly 2:1 advantage, so you can use a smaller line. One sees reef clewlines of 1/2" rope, with a break strength approaching 5 tons, and an effective strength of nearly twice that. Something is wrong with that. So with clewlines it is possible, not that you need to taper the line, but that the line is too big.
Fair leads,
Brion Toss

[Stumble]

Terrier,

It depends on the drum. Usually tie it on, or a quick splice. Once you have a couple of wraps the knot doesn't carry the load, and by using a much smaller line than normal you can add a few extra wraps easily. On my Beneteau 381 I use 3/16 dyneema for the front section. It is so small it freaky people out, and I wouldn't recommend it because if there is any chaff you could have big problems. But I like doing this stuff, and the line is still massively over strong.

I started using this on race boats where we really were worried about weight, but adopted in on the cruiser when we switched to a 155 geneoa. Switching out the furler just isn't going to happen, and I was tired of the line crushing into itself on the drum.