measuring lifelines ?

[Brian Duff]

How do you measure for lifelines ?

by this I mean what format do you measure and record teh lengths to build to ?

I am in the habit of always pinning my tape (0") at one end pulpit, and then recording the distance to each relevant fitting- so that you might see - turnbuckle 0" at bow pulpit, 24'8" to single gateeye and pelican at lifeline gate stanchion, to 29' 10" at stern pulpit with toggle. or whatever.

Whats your usual way ? - I have run into some confusion as we don't own a swage machine ( hate the things , but I think one is on its way to my shop any day now) so we order them from other suppliers, and sometimes they come wrong.

I wanted to come up with a standard I could argue with !

lol

[Ian McColgin]

Isn't just the measure pin center to pin center the standard?

[Brian Duff]

ahh, but with lifelines you have to deal with bearing points-not pin centers, and then there are the gate eyes, pelican hooks and the like, so a side might have 3 or 4 very important measures. I bring all this up as part of a dispute with a supplier.

He agrees that my way of measuring is the standard, and that it was their mistake, but am I really right ?

this industry would be so much easier (perhaps less rewarding, but easier) if there were published standards of how to do all this stuff. The RA is great, but we need a real nuts and bolts manual similar to Nigel Calders book, even more technical. I guess I'd better get writing (yeah!)

so I am here hunting more input

[Matthew Sebring]

I've always measured from center of pin at turnbuckle (or what-have-you) to the bearing surface of the gate eye and then for the gate itself from bearing surface of one gate eye to the bearing surface of the gate eye or bail on the other side. Then when I make make it up I can clamp those gate eyes down on my table and then make up the gate assembly between them. In terms of a standard way to do it, I doubt there is one.

[Brian Duff]

What I am trying to get at is, do you list the measurements accumulation or for each section individually?

No joke, there seems to be no standards in our industry whatsoever, except maybe ABYC, but they don't really concern rigging , do they ?

I wonder if the eurpeons have any more regulation or standards we could work to ?


man

[Matthew Sebring]

No, I don't do a cumulative measurement, just the individual sections. Then I do and overall measurement basically to double check that I measured the sections correctly (that everything adds up).

[Brion Toss]

Hi there,
We, too, have had numerous lifeline/supplier issues over the years. The biggest single preventative measure is to have an accurate drawing, with terminal types included. The drawing shows bearing point measurements as well as lengths. You can check to see that the segments add up to LOA, though this invlolves stanchion thickness to be taken into account.
A written list, as an emphatic/consistent backup is also a good idea. And a supplier that is paying attention is a plus.
As for standards, funny you should mention that; we have been talking about the idea for years, and are possibly about to do something about it. More on this soon.
Fair leads,
Brion Toss

[kristian]

As always, it depends!

If I'm replicating an existing span of wire, I'll generally use the pin center standard. If measuring for a new or lost lifeline I'll measure from the bearing points.

The most important detail here for me is to make accurate notes on every measurement. For example, I have a Beneteau that I'm making new lifelines for tomorrow. The rear gate has existing pieces of wire that fit well, but everything along the sheer is missing. My notes read something like:

Rear Gate Top: End stud (1/4 28 x 3.5") to pin center (toggle jaw 1/4" pin) 6 '4 1/2"
Fwd Span Bottom: BP pulpit eye to BP (aft face stanchion for gate eye) 35' 8 5/16"

I do most of my 1/8"-1/4" swaging in house, but for the things that have to be ordered I:
a)order from someone good, who I know will ask questions if anything looks even slightly off or is unclear
b)make really really clear notes. While this may take a couple seconds of extra time it's never hurt me to have more info than less.

Just today I saved myself over a grand by having good notes. I went to measure of pair of match racing boats for new standing rigging. Looked pretty normal, Tballs and turnbuckles etc etc. Just for kicks I measured the backing plates and TBalls. Before making out my build sheet I decided to double check the Navtec Tballs. Turns out they weren't even close, and were in fact OS Rigging parts from Sweden. If I had made the sets of rigging up with standard TBalls, they'd be totally wrong and I'd end up replacing them.